Moved to proton pass a while ago. Bitwarden support is just shit.

They get a pass. If they are ever stranded in a deserted island and must kill to survive they get a pass too. Same for if they are about to starve and the only option is hunting a gazelle.

All the other vegans and I agree. We had a meeting.

That’s not even a rounding error in the amount of cruelty and murder we inflict upon animals though. The main concern right now is stop the senseless cycle of breeding little mutant animals in hellish conditions just to murder them at a young age. The scale of that dwarfs all other forms of animal abuse by a few orders of magnitude.

The Vegan Society defines veganism as a philosophy and way of living that seeks to exclude as far as is possible and practicable all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing, or any other purpose.

I feel like that is a good definition and a good way to go about it.

Pretty much.

Oof. It gets repetitive hearing the same arguments.

In modern society, almost all personal choices have victims, it’s all connected.

This is the there’s no ethical consumption under capitalism argument.

True however there are degrees of difficulty and effect of your actions. Picking soy milk at a super market instead of milk takes barely no effort and has discernible good effects. Sure there’s also exploitation in the making of the soy milk. That’s a different issue. Which if you care enough I can also point you in the direction that I choose to combat that.

Evil existing isn’t a sensible moral justification for inflicting more evil into the world. Do your part to make the world a better place.

If you truly believe that statement applies 100% of the time

This is the let’s make this impersonal and ask “what do words even mean” argument.

Dont be obtuse is my answer to that.

For some, eating meat is life and death, through no fault of their own.

This is the “what if you were on a deserted island and there was only a single cow in it. Would you eat it” argument.

I’m not sure if your statement is true. But sure. If that is true. They get a pass. I’ve had a meeting with the other vegans. They all agree too.

That isn’t the case for me though. It isn’t for you either. It isn’t the case for the vast majority of people.

Maybe the Inuit had to 300 years ago. You have a Walmart near you. Be real.

Oh man. I could go on again about how it’s not because you can inflict violence that you should and that you’re justified doing so because you can. I’ve already mentioned that in the other reply to you.

So there are two more points I’d like to make.

1. Do you think there’s a possibility you’ve been propagandized to the point where critique of meat eating feels like a personal attack? Because if you notice I’ve been nothing but cordial to you while both your comments you tried to do personal attacks. “Go eat kale”, “limp wristed pacifism”, neither are accurate. But would you examine why you feel like resorting to that?

2. veganism is indeed much better for the environment. Cows are extremely thermodynamically inefficient. If you’re vegan you plant something you eat it and you get the calories you need. For animal farming you have to plant a bunch feed the cow. Plant more feed the cow. Do it for years and then kill the cow. Any argument of efficiency is an argument for veganism. Not against it. So no. Eating meat has a much worse quantifiable impact on the environment. Most studies put it at 10 to 20 times worse. Very easy to look up if you care enough.

And if you reply to this “what about hunting”, “what about roadkill”, “what about them natives” which are the usual retorts. I’d say who cares about any of that. That’s not even a rounding error in the total meat consumption we do as a species and total amount of unnecessary cruelty we inflict on animals.

Indeed. Great username btw.

You’re absolutely right. You currently can choose to do all of that.

But just because you can do something doesn’t mean that you should nor that doing the thing is the right thing to do right ?

You can also just as easily choose not to inflict violence and cruelty on those who can’t defend themselves.

Homie. If there was a magical sequence of words that made people understand that exploiting and committing violence against those who are weaker you was wrong the world would be such a better place already.

I think the only way to achieve that is slowly through better education. But even that is difficult when people distrust education.

It’s bad. Very bad.

I spent the past month or so looking for my first job out or school. And so many places make you jump through hoops or have humiliation session interviews.

The place I accepted the offer from called me once for screening. Then set up a technical interview.

The technical interview was half of it talking about who I am. What I like to do. What I want to work on etc. and the other half them explaining what the job is, why it’s a great opportunity etc.

Next day I got the offer. Simplest process ever and not humiliating at all. Felt like the exception. There are decent people out there still.

Decency and mercy are when I place my shot to dispatch an animal to reduce its suffering as much as possible.

Okay. I appreciate that you do that.

Have you considered that to reduce the animals suffering as much as possible you could just… not shoot it? And then to on about your day doing literally anything else that makes you happy?

I’m not going to disagree with you that “but meat tastes better”. Or that hunting is fun and there’s an emotional connection that hunters can get to it.

But you can literally do anything else other than inflict violence and cruelty on those weaker than you. It’s a choice.

Food is a deeply personal issue that we should try not to moralize, I understand that can be difficult

Personal issues end where others right to exist begin. A personal choice is what color choice you wanna be wear in the morning.

If your personal choice has victims, claiming it’s a personal choice ceases to be a valid reasoning to do it. And yes. Choosing to eat meat has victims. You’re eating your victims.

Homie. Thinking that cutting a pigs throat and cutting the stem of a tomato are morally equivalent is something to talk about with a therapist or a trusted friend. It’s not an interesting moral position.

Food chain still exists, home slice, and I’m at the top of it. Doesn’t change my feelings about labor rights, or housing, or healthcare. You’re presenting a false equivalence argument.

Corporate chain still exists home slice. And I’m at the top of it. Doesn’t change my feelings about exploiting you, not giving you proper social safety nets or healthcare.

Might makes right is a shit argument.